Hellcat (non-OSP)

3105 Views 24 Replies 8 Participants Last post by joseph.pavelchak, 5 mo ago

joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · 10 mo ago

Hello to all! New to Springfield products. I have a Hellcat, a non-OSP version, which, i believe, has a major safety issue with the trigger. I have sent Springfield a memo but have received no reply; not even simply hit the road and don't bother us.
So, i am looking for help from this forum. The trigger problem is not what i have seen running on the web where the safety catch is slightly filed. Here is the issue:
1. Hellcat is confirmed that is has no mag and is unloaded and not in battery.
2. I rack the slide.
3. Slowly i move the trigger back to a point just before the break.
4. I release the trigger (the trigger was not pulled to fire).
5. The trigger does not move to full reset so the safety is not set to on position.
6. With the state described in #5, it is possible to fire without touching the safety.
I am concerned very much that under this scenario, if i try to re-holster, i may accidently fire the Hellcat unintentionally.
Any help and/or guidance will be most appreciated.

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Hellraiser

· #2 · 10 mo ago

2

I would contact Springfield about the issue & wouldn't use it as a carry weapon until it is resolved
I have a diagram of the frame & it doesn't show the internals of the trigger & the safety trigger dingus
Assume it is very Glock Like but haven't seen a trigger shoe apart, there has to be a spring that pushes the safety back forward, either spring or leaf type, metal or polymer
It is also possible there is a bur in the polymer causing the issue
I do not see a trigger return spring in the diagram & assume the strikers spring moves the trigger forward
I'm sure Springfield Armory will take care of the problem though
I'd call them Monday- Friday 8:00-5:00 800-680-6868
Good Luck & Let us all know the outcome please
1st SA & having an issue would leave a bad taste in your mouth

Welcome to the Forum @joseph.pavelchak

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joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · #3 · 10 mo ago

Dear Springfield Forum Friend,
Wow, many thanks for such a very prompt response and all the great information and contact number for the Armory. My first attempt at contacting Springfield was by email but have not received any response at all.
At present i have only two handguns. My first, that i used as my CCW, was a Glock G19 gen 5; which has always, and continues, to work great. I purchased the Hellcat because is was considerably smaller and lighter and still had a great capacity. Having only two handguns you can probably tell that i am in no way an expert, or even a well informed person, about handguns.
I did quite a bit research on the Hellcat and trigger issues and found quite a bit information on how the trigger would bind up if pressed slightly to one side or the other; the result of which would simply make the handgun not fire. What i found with my issue is much worse since under very simple circumstances the safety becomes nonexistent. For that reason, i have no abandoned using the Hellcat until i can get the issue resolved. For me, this is a major safety issue.
You may be correct that it is possible that the striker spring might be involved. I have an off-market (not OEM) heavier striker spring and will definitely try that retrofit and see what happens. If that does not correct the problem, i will call the Springfield Armory for help and guidance.
Again, many thanks for taking time to respond and for all the great information.

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tu_s

· #4 · 10 mo ago

Take a look at the striker blocker/safety in the slide, part 28 in the picture. If it is sticking because the spring in there with it is not aligned correctly it can keep the trigger from resetting.

Sleddog30

· #5 · 10 mo ago

joseph.pavelchak said:
Dear Springfield Forum Friend,
Wow, many thanks for such a very prompt response and all the great information and contact number for the Armory. My first attempt at contacting Springfield was by email but have not received any response at all.
At present i have only two handguns. My first, that i used as my CCW, was a Glock G19 gen 5; which has always, and continues, to work great. I purchased the Hellcat because is was considerably smaller and lighter and still had a great capacity. Having only two handguns you can probably tell that i am in no way an expert, or even a well informed person, about handguns.
I did quite a bit research on the Hellcat and trigger issues and found quite a bit information on how the trigger would bind up if pressed slightly to one side or the other; the result of which would simply make the handgun not fire. What i found with my issue is much worse since under very simple circumstances the safety becomes nonexistent. For that reason, i have no abandoned using the Hellcat until i can get the issue resolved. For me, this is a major safety issue.
You may be correct that it is possible that the striker spring might be involved. I have an off-market (not OEM) heavier striker spring and will definitely try that retrofit and see what happens. If that does not correct the problem, i will call the Springfield Armory for help and guidance.
Again, many thanks for taking time to respond and for all the great information.

Remove the striker spring you installed and install the OEM one. Try testing it again and see what happens. You need to do this first before calling Springfield. You may have caused the issue by using the non-OEM spring.

Hellraiser

· #6 · 10 mo ago

Possible deep cleaning of the striker channel & might as well clean the striker safety & extractor while the rear cover plate is removed too
DO NOT LUBRICATE THE STRIKER or any component in the slide other than maybe the tip of the firing pin safety where the trigger bar rides over it + slide rails
You will find the problem & IF NOT Springfield will help you out
They won't get to those e-mails till tomorrow morning & possibly a nice call would be in your best interest
I would think they would give you a shipping label & want it immediately

GOOD LUCK!

BEWARE of the little pin inside the extractor spring, when it fell out of mine, I said, "OH NO!"

Were the Hell did that come from when it hit my shoes & disappeared into the carpet, On my knees with a flashlight I found this little pin
After looking at the diagram up above I figured it out, but had me wondering?

Product Purple Cosmetics Material property Office supplies

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joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · #7 · 10 mo ago

Greetings Springfield Forum Team,
Well, all i can say is you folks are super great! All of your suggestions were outstanding which resulted in fixing the issue. This was a very valuable learning experience for me. Just in case someone else, falls into this trap, allow me to explain my total stupidity in believing what is on the web.
Unlike my G19.5, the trigger pull on the Hellcat is much higher. For some of us with bad arthritis, the 6.5+ Lb pull is slightly uncomfortable. So, checking the web i found a spring upgrade kit, specific to the Hellcat, which promised to lower the trigger pull by ~ 1.5 Lbs. Additionally, the info (actually a video) on this upgrade kit mentioned that the OEM striker sleeve, which is plastic, would break after some use. Well, i believed all this and purchased the kit and installed all the parts. The installation was quite easy and simple. Immediately after this install, is where the problem started.
The bottom line is that the striker spring is simply not strong enough to fully reset the trigger if it is depressed before the break and then released. This caused the safety to not fully retract and reset. What a dummy me :-(. After studying all the great information, i followed one suggestion to go back to the original OEM parts. I did that and all is now working perfectly. I now have my Hellcat back to use as my carry handgun - all thanks to you folks.
If you have some time to spare, could someone comment on the idea that the striker sleeve can really break that easily? If so, is there any merit in keeping all the OEM springs but replace the plastic sleeve with a ss version?
Many thanks in advance for any continued help and guidance.

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Hellraiser

· #8 · 10 mo ago

I have never seen a striker sleeve break on a Glock ever
Haven't had the Springfield long enough to know but would guess the same is true about the SA
Glad you got it worked out
Gary

joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · #9 · 10 mo ago

Good morning, Gary,
Greetings! Thanks for the information. The sleeve breaking was on a Hellcat not on a Glock; although i don't know what the Glock part is made of. The Hellcat sleeve is made of plastic. The spring upgrade kit came with a stainless steel sleeve. I was just wondering is there is any merit in a retrofit from plastic to ss. Has anyone make that change to ss without any issues? At present the Hellcat is back to fully OEM with no mods.

Reactions: 1

Hellraiser

· #10 · 10 mo ago

I wasn't clear, a Glock has very similar design

I wouldn't use the SS Sleeve, stay 100% factory with the polymer sleeve
Nylon/Polymer/Plastic has a self-lubricating property that stainless does not have
In fact, stainless on stainless would gall IMO...

I could see how the lightened striker spring could upset the reset of the trigger on a striker fired handgun of this design

So Glad you got it "FIXED" & no trip to the Mother Ship was needed

BTW I am 56 & retired & have arthritis too, Hands hurt from years of work & torture, aching right now...

GOOD MORNING!! 7:00am here now
Off to Kroger for some grub 😋

Which handgun to take = Glock 43x in Tulster Profile Holster
I have a new "We The People" Holster coming for the Hellcat & this should change
But can get by with a paddle holster I have or a Sticky holster

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WVSurveyor

· #11 · 10 mo ago

Glad your issue is resolved. Kudos to all those who responded. It would have been more obvious if you'd have mentioned your alterations to the weapon in your initial post. I believe most people, like myself, figured your Hellcat was stock, especially since you called Springfield about the problem. Through the years I have made alterations to numerous handguns and on occasion, when they were put back together, didn't work properly. At that point, I knew I hadn't installed something correctly or the parts were not up to snuff. Anyhow, it's good to have forums such as this where we can discuss issues and problems or just sit and chew the fat.

joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · #12 · 10 mo ago

Greetings to all!! It's great to have a forum where people discuss issues that are in common to their interests. I must say that when i contacted Springfield or even this forum, i didn't connect the modifications with the problem. Here is why that was the case. Since i purchased the new Hellcat, about 10 months ago, i have been unable to get to the range to hot fire it. Reasons were many but mostly related to medical issues (am now an old fart of 82 years old but still kicking). So, in the interim i have been using the Hellcat for dry fire. I have a laser training cartridge which helps in the shooting practice. During dry fire, i simply racked and pulled the trigger never really noticing the full position of the trigger after a partial trigger pull. Even after the mods, all appeared normal after a rack/pull/fire. Not sure what made me check the trigger position but am thinking it was probably the feel of where the trigger was vs where it should have been. I am sure that most of the folks who are on this forum as seasoned shooters and would have noticed a problem immediately after a modification. I am new to handgun shooting even though i spent 6 years in the Army (1968 RVN vet). I trained on the M16 and M79.
Well, with everyone's kind help and good advice, the Hellcat is back as fully OEM and working again. Unfortunately, the trigger pull is back to the original 6.5 Lbs. It looks like there is no safe way of making mods to this model of handgun.
Last question for anyone - - and i think i already know the answer. Is a 10mm too much as a CC?
To all - - have a great day and a safe one as well.

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WVSurveyor

· #13 · 10 mo ago

God bless you and thank you for your service.
Some folks like 10mm and swear by it. I have never fired one so I don't know how well it would work for me as a CC caliber in a smaller firearm. I feel 9mm with modern hollow point bullets is more than capable, especially with the variety of concealable handguns now available. That's my 2 cents on that matter.
I also don't own a hellcat, but there are mods you can make that will supposedly reduce the trigger pull weight and improve the reset. Others on here can address their actual experience on that.
Here are some links to popular companies in that field. You can also find numerous Youtube videos on the subject.

PRP parts triggers for Hellcat (powderriverprecision.com)
Action Enhancement Trigger for Hellcat (apextactical.com)
Springfield Hellcat Flat Trigger Upgrade - Springfield Hellcat Accessories by M*CARBO! (mcarbo.com)
Monarch Trigger System for the Springfield Hellcat - HYVE Technologies (hyve-technologies.com)

I have dealt with MCarbo in the past on parts for a CZ. They are an excellent company.
Powder River specializes in Springfield products but I have no personal experience with them.
Tried an Apex trigger on a Glock. They are a good company although I never really did come to like Glock's. I've read where their trigger can be an issue on a Hellcat.
Don't know anything about the HYVE Monarch trigger.

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joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · #14 · 10 mo ago

Greeting to you WVsurveor,
Thank you for taking time to respond and for the great info and all the URL links. The spring upgrade kit was a M-Carbo product and the reason i selected that brand was that is has a very good rating my customers. I am not faulting their springs or the striker sleeve as they all did fit perfectly and did work but not to full expectation. It is possible that my Hellcat has some other issue which caused the striker spring to not work properly; although using the OEM parts work perfectly. I did send off a brief memo to M-Carbo about my issue but it was not a complaining type letter but one of questioning if there was some other adjustment that i could make to make their spring work properly. M-Carbo does respond quickly so i am sure they may have some alternatives for me to lower the trigger pull force.
Have a great day Sir!

Reactions: 1

Hellraiser

· #15 · 10 mo ago

10mm as a CC = Glock 29

Addison3

· #16 · 9 mo ago

joseph.pavelchak said:
Dear Springfield Forum Friend,
Wow, many thanks for such a very prompt response and all the great information and contact number for the Armory. My first attempt at contacting Springfield was by email but have not received any response at all.
At present i have only two handguns. My first, that i used as my CCW, was a Glock G19 gen 5; which has always, and continues, to work great. I purchased the Hellcat because is was considerably smaller and lighter and still had a great capacity. Having only two handguns you can probably tell that i am in no way an expert, or even a well informed person, about handguns.
I did quite a bit research on the Hellcat and trigger issues and found quite a bit information on how the trigger would bind up if pressed slightly to one side or the other; the result of which would simply make the handgun not fire. What i found with my issue is much worse since under very simple circumstances the safety becomes nonexistent. For that reason, i have no abandoned using the Hellcat until i can get the issue resolved. For me, this is a major safety issue.
You may be correct that it is possible that the striker spring might be involved. I have an off-market (not OEM) heavier striker spring and will definitely try that retrofit and see what happens. If that does not correct the problem, i will call the Springfield Armory for help and guidance.
Again, many thanks for taking time to respond and for all the great information.

Not to hijack your post but I have a similar issue with my Hellcat Pro. In my case I replaced the factory trigger with a Power River precision trigger and kit. As of now I am using just the new trigger and its worked great. Now to my problem... I recently bight a new striker kit because I had been wanting the stainless steel end cap which came plastic from the manufacture.
Only after installing the new striker assembly did I begin to experience my trigger being mushy when pulling as you discernible . before the break when I let off the trigger it would not return to its full position.
I then disassembled and reinstalled my factory Striker unit and everything returned to normal. This leaves me thinking the possible problem is the lighter spring used in the titanium striker unit.
I hope this might be of help to you and possibly find out one way or another if the issue is a lighter spring or is it something else.

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joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · #17 · 9 mo ago

Addison3 said:
Not to hijack your post but I have a similar issue with my Hellcat Pro. In my case I replaced the factory trigger with a Power River precision trigger and kit. As of now I am using just the new trigger and its worked great. Now to my problem... I recently bight a new striker kit because I had been wanting the stainless steel end cap which came plastic from the manufacture.
Only after installing the new striker assembly did I begin to experience my trigger being mushy when pulling as you discernible . before the break when I let off the trigger it would not return to its full position.
I then disassembled and reinstalled my factory Striker unit and everything returned to normal. This leaves me thinking the possible problem is the lighter spring used in the titanium striker unit.
I hope this might be of help to you and possibly find out one way or another if the issue is a lighter spring or is it something else.

Hello Hellraiser,
Ah yes, i know exactly what you are seeing. If you replaced only the striker spring and sleeve, that by itself will not work correctly. If the striker kit is one from M-Carbo, then please also install the other two springs. Once you install all three springs and the striker sleeve, you should see much better improvement and functionality. I just went thru a series of issues but for me the issue was the OEM trigger. After i made the mod to the plastic trigger, for me all went very well. I now have my Hellcat working perfectly with a reduced trigger pull and a new ss striker sleeve.
Let me know if after replacing the other two springs everything started to work. Thanks.

Addison3

· #18 · 9 mo ago

joseph.pavelchak said:
Greetings Springfield Forum Team,
Well, all i can say is you folks are super great! All of your suggestions were outstanding which resulted in fixing the issue. This was a very valuable learning experience for me. Just in case someone else, falls into this trap, allow me to explain my total stupidity in believing what is on the web.
Unlike my G19.5, the trigger pull on the Hellcat is much higher. For some of us with bad arthritis, the 6.5+ Lb pull is slightly uncomfortable. So, checking the web i found a spring upgrade kit, specific to the Hellcat, which promised to lower the trigger pull by ~ 1.5 Lbs. Additionally, the info (actually a video) on this upgrade kit mentioned that the OEM striker sleeve, which is plastic, would break after some use. Well, i believed all this and purchased the kit and installed all the parts. The installation was quite easy and simple. Immediately after this install, is where the problem started.
The bottom line is that the striker spring is simply not strong enough to fully reset the trigger if it is depressed before the break and then released. This caused the safety to not fully retract and reset. What a dummy me :-(. After studying all the great information, i followed one suggestion to go back to the original OEM parts. I did that and all is now working perfectly. I now have my Hellcat back to use as my carry handgun - all thanks to you folks.
If you have some time to spare, could someone comment on the idea that the striker sleeve can really break that easily? If so, is there any merit in keeping all the OEM springs but replace the plastic sleeve with a ss version?
Many thanks in advance for any continued help and guidance.

joseph.pavelchak said:
Greetings Springfield Forum Team,
Well, all i can say is you folks are super great! All of your suggestions were outstanding which resulted in fixing the issue. This was a very valuable learning experience for me. Just in case someone else, falls into this trap, allow me to explain my total stupidity in believing what is on the web.
Unlike my G19.5, the trigger pull on the Hellcat is much higher. For some of us with bad arthritis, the 6.5+ Lb pull is slightly uncomfortable. So, checking the web i found a spring upgrade kit, specific to the Hellcat, which promised to lower the trigger pull by ~ 1.5 Lbs. Additionally, the info (actually a video) on this upgrade kit mentioned that the OEM striker sleeve, which is plastic, would break after some use. Well, i believed all this and purchased the kit and installed all the parts. The installation was quite easy and simple. Immediately after this install, is where the problem started.
The bottom line is that the striker spring is simply not strong enough to fully reset the trigger if it is depressed before the break and then released. This caused the safety to not fully retract and reset. What a dummy me :-(. After studying all the great information, i followed one suggestion to go back to the original OEM parts. I did that and all is now working perfectly. I now have my Hellcat back to use as my carry handgun - all thanks to you folks.
If you have some time to spare, could someone comment on the idea that the striker sleeve can really break that easily? If so, is there any merit in keeping all the OEM springs but replace the plastic sleeve with a ss version?
Many thanks in advance for any continued help and guidance.

Good morning... I am very happy to hear your problem has been resolved. It seems you and I bought the same striker kit as our experience is one and the same. In my case I bought the striker kit not so much to lesson the trigger pull but wanted the stainless steep striker sleeve for the same reason as you. the other part I felt would be good would be the Titanium striker that was part of the kit.
I will say that the company I purchased from was very responsive and offered to have me ship my Hellcat to them to remedy the problem. As it sits now my Hellcat is working as should be after reinstalling the OEM striker assembly.
At this point I intend to try the kit in my son's Hellcat Pro "if he lets me" to see the the problem persists in his.
I had thought about returning the kit and seeing if they would refund it, but my feeing is they would want to try and fix the problem before going the refund route.
Have you given thought about returning the unit?

joseph.pavelchak

Discussion Starter · #19 · 9 mo ago

Addison3 said:
Good morning... I am very happy to hear your problem has been resolved. It seems you and I bought the same striker kit as our experience is one and the same. In my case I bought the striker kit not so much to lesson the trigger pull but wanted the stainless steep striker sleeve for the same reason as you. the other part I felt would be good would be the Titanium striker that was part of the kit.
I will say that the company I purchased from was very responsive and offered to have me ship my Hellcat to them to remedy the problem. As it sits now my Hellcat is working as should be after reinstalling the OEM striker assembly.
At this point I intend to try the kit in my son's Hellcat Pro "if he lets me" to see the the problem persists in his.
I had thought about returning the kit and seeing if they would refund it, but my feeing is they would want to try and fix the problem before going the refund route.
Have you given thought about returning the unit?

I have been working with M-Carbo, Mr. Noble, and he is very responsive to any issues. The breaking of the striker sleeve is a claim made in the ad from M-Carbo. I have not seen any web posts about the plastic sleeve breaking. It may be the case and may not. I think more users of the Hellcat will bring out the question of the sleeve breaking. Retrofit the plastic sleeve with a ss may be a good idea as a metal part might outlast a plastic one. On the other hand, the plastic part is self lubricating so that might be a plus. I am by no means a seasoned shooter to post any suggestions that have any merit.
I had been working with M-Carbo and Mr. Noble for about 10-12 days. I sent them two videos of how the Hellcat behaved with their spring parts (sleeve included) and how it behaved with the OEM parts. They were not able to reproduce what i was seeing. However, my Hellcat is one of the original, not the newer Pro versions, so it is very possible that on newer models none of the problem would be seen.
In the end, after i made a very minor mod to the Hellcat's plastic trigger and then re-installed all three springs and sleeve, everything worked as it did with the OEM parts. So, at least for my Hellcat, all is well and i am a happy camper again.

Just as an addendum, the M-Carbo spring kit did reduce the trigger pull considerably such that it was a great help for my arthritic dominant hand.
Last question to this forum team: Has anyone had the Hellcat's slide milled for a RDO? If so, could you send me a link to the milling service that did it. I was considering turning in the Hellcat and purchasing one with the slide already milled but i don't think i could get enough for the Hellcat as a trade in vs. getting a mill job.
Have a great and safe day.

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Addison3

· #20 · 9 mo ago

joseph.pavelchak said:
I have been working with M-Carbo, Mr. Noble, and he is very responsive to any issues. The breaking of the striker sleeve is a claim made in the ad from M-Carbo. I have not seen any web posts about the plastic sleeve breaking. It may be the case and may not. I think more users of the Hellcat will bring out the question of the sleeve breaking. Retrofit the plastic sleeve with a ss may be a good idea as a metal part might outlast a plastic one. On the other hand, the plastic part is self lubricating so that might be a plus. I am by no means a seasoned shooter to post any suggestions that have any merit.
I had been working with M-Carbo and Mr. Noble for about 10-12 days. I sent them two videos of how the Hellcat behaved with their spring parts (sleeve included) and how it behaved with the OEM parts. They were not able to reproduce what i was seeing. However, my Hellcat is one of the original, not the newer Pro versions, so it is very possible that on newer models none of the problem would be seen.
In the end, after i made a very minor mod to the Hellcat's plastic trigger and then re-installed all three springs and sleeve, everything worked as it did with the OEM parts. So, at least for my Hellcat, all is well and i am a happy camper again. Just as an addendum, the M-Carbo spring kit did reduce the trigger pull considerably such that it was a great help for my arthritic dominant hand.
Last question to this forum team: Has anyone had the Hellcat's slide milled for a RDO? If so, could you send me a link to the milling service that did it. I was considering turning in the Hellcat and purchasing one with the slide already milled but i don't think i could get enough for the Hellcat as a trade in vs. getting a mill job.
Have a great and safe day.

Just to note: My Hellcat is the "PRO" model. Will you be keeping the kit you bought? or have they offered you a return? Just asking because they have been very willing to have me send my gun in, but I have never done any kind of shipping of firearms for issues such as this.

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