You are Unregistered, please register to use all of the features of SpringfieldForum.com    
Springfield Forum > General Firearms Discussion > Gunsmithing >

Magazine - Storage

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-09-2017, 10:29 PM   #1
threetango
Retired Army First Sgt
SFF_MODERATOR.png
 
threetango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1,246
Liked 740 Times on 539 Posts
Likes Given: 653

Default Magazine - Storage

Some good info in this article.

Link

http://www.usacarry.com/magazine-storage/
__________________
"Top"
11B5PF7M retired

“Slow Is Smooth, Smooth Is Fast.”
threetango is offline  
SHOOTER13 Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2017, 01:49 PM   #2
unclebob
 
unclebob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Illinois
Posts: 56
Liked 29 Times on 20 Posts
Likes Given: 32

Default

I am late to the polymer game, so when I bought my MOD-2, I wrote to tech support and asked them the same question.
Their response was to rotate your magazines every month.
For now I will abide by their recommendations.
__________________
Everybody brings happiness, some by staying and some by leaving...
unclebob is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2017, 05:40 PM   #3
SHOOTER13
RETIRED MODERATOR
SFF_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
 
SHOOTER13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: PENNSYLVANIA
Posts: 3,388
Liked 761 Times on 618 Posts
Likes Given: 1644

Default

Thanks Top...as always !!
__________________


__________________
SHOOTER13 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2017, 09:37 PM   #4
threetango
Retired Army First Sgt
SFF_MODERATOR.png
 
threetango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1,246
Liked 740 Times on 539 Posts
Likes Given: 653

Default

A quality magazine will have a quality spring.

It's a known fact that springs wear out from use, not from their static condition (loaded or unloaded).

This is a bit long but gives a detailed explanation.

Here you go:
Magazine spring madness: 'creep' to your 'elastic limit' to un-earth the urban legend of 'spring-set'
American Handgunner, by John S. Layman

The shooting sports are full of some of the most knowledgeable and capable people you'll meet anywhere. I've been impressed consistently with the abilities of those I meet at the range to diagnose and fix a gun problem with as little as some spray lube and a cotton swab. However, sometimes a myth will creep into the folklore.

The magazine spring myth has been around for many years and is growing in popularity. It goes something like this: "You should unload your magazines when they're not in use or the spring will weaken causing failures to feed." This has gone as far as shooting competitors actually unloading their magazines between stages to extend the life of their springs. A variant of this myth is: "You should never load a magazine to capacity and should always leave it one round short." What if you need that round some day?

Recently, I read an article in a gun magazine suggesting you rotate your magazines so the ones not in use can "recover and rest." The same author uses the phrase "spring-set" to describe weakness of a spring because it was compressed for a long time. Hogwash. There's nothing further from the truth. Springs don't care how long they're compressed and don't require rest, recreation or even a vacation from time to time.

To put this one to rest, you have to understand creep. Creep is the slow flow of a non-ferric metal like copper, brass and lead under force. At temperatures outside of a furnace, steel doesn't have any appreciable creep. Under most conditions, steel flexes and then returns to its original shape. When pushed past its elastic limit, steel will bend and not return to its original shape. All designers of well-made magazines make sure the spring never approaches the elastic limit when the magazine is fully loaded. Honest. This means the spring will not weaken when the magazine is fully loaded -- not even over an extended time. Like 50 years. American Handgunner recently ran a story about a magazine full of .45 ACP that had been sitting since WWII and it ran just fine on the first try. So there you go.

Now that the light of truth is leaking out, lets talk about what is causing failures to feed. The only way to weaken a magazine spring is to flex it past its normal range (elastic limit). If this is happening, somebody is trying to overload a magazine or has "adjusted" it by bending the spring. Both of these could cause feed failures. Shame on you if you're a spring bender.

Carlton Nether, Customer Service for Beretta USA, tells us keeping a pistol magazine loaded for an extended period doesn't cause magazine spring failure, however, failures to feed can result. He says, "The ammo will 'roll' in the magazine. If the mags are kept loaded and moved around a lot -- say on a cop's belt -- the rolling action can, over time, cause creases in the cases. These creases can cause malfunctions. Also the top bullet will roll against the magazine lips and creasing can occur there as well. Just check old ammo that's been bouncing around in a magazine for a long time.

We tell police officers if they keep loaded magazines, take a few seconds to "cycle" the ammo. Periodically unload the mag and reload it in a different sequence. This movement will allow the bullets to be in different parts of the magazine and help eliminate creasing.

At STI, Dave Skinner, President and CEO says, "Personally, I rotate my 'under the bed' and 'under the seat' mags about every six months. I always empty them the 'fun' way and have never had a failure." Given what we learned above, this sounds like a good idea. Smith and Wesson customer service also says magazines can stay loaded indefinitely without hurting the spring.

As we add force onto a spring, it will displace the same amount for each amount of force we add. This is true until the spring passes a certain point called the elastic limit. Robert Hooke discovered this theory back in 1660. Hooke's Law states: "If the applied forces on a body are not too large, the deformations resulting are directly proportional to the forces producing them." Which means, in actual human being language, if we load a spring past its elastic limit, it permanently deforms. It still provides a force against the load but the force is no longer proportional. If this happens, when we unload the spring (such as when we empty a magazine that has been over-loaded) the spring never returns to a state where it can provide the same load for the same amount of displacement.

Trust Us

When a magazine manufacturer designs a spring, they plan for a preload. The spring is already compressed some in the magazine. On the curve below, this would be Point A. The spring compression would be designed to be below the Elastic Limit. When fully compressed, the spring would be at Point B. If the spring is ever compressed past the elastic limit, say to Point C, it won't ever behave the same. Like a recalcitrant lazy Uncle, it will have a lower spring force for each amount of displacement. On the drawing, the spring would now cycle between points D and E. This means that -- particularly with the last bullet or two -- the force pushing the bullet up would be less and lo-and-behold, a mis-feed might occur.
When somebody stretches your spring to "fix" your magazine, they are trying to get you back on the original curve. They may get pretty close, however, it's unlikely the spring will ever perform to its original design. The elastic limit is now shifted lower and your magazine spring may fail to perform fairly quickly.

Having said all this, if you have a magazine that isn't feeding right, what should you do? First, disassemble the magazine and clean it thoroughly. Then try it with new, factory ammunition in a freshly cleaned gun. This takes away some of the possible causes. If you are still having feed problems, send it back. Even the low cost, after-market magazine manufacturers will fix the problem at no cost to you other than shipping. If it's a magazine from the gun's manufacturer, let them troubleshoot and repair the problem. Otherwise, toss the mag. It's not worth risking your life to save a few bucks. And that's the truth.
Creep: The flow or plastic deformation of metals held for long periods of time at stresses lower than the normal yield strength.

Elastic Limit: The maximum stress that material will stand before permanent deformation occurs.

Yield Strength: The stress at which the metal changes from elastic to plastic in behavior, i.e., takes a permanent set.

Permanent Set: Non-elastic or plastic, deformation of metal under stress, after passing the elastic limit.

Magazine Recommendations

* Clean your magazines when they get gritty. Apply oil then remove all excess. Oil attracts dirt that may cause malfunction.

* If you find rust on the spring, this is culprit. Rust changes the thickness of the metal and reduces the force applied to the follower. Cleaning off the rust may help. For a gun you depend on, replace the spring. All the major brands and most of the smaller ones have replacement mag springs available or try Wolff Springs.

* If you keep a magazine loaded for long periods, rotate the rounds every few months. If you carry a pistol on the job or in your car, cycle the ammo frequently. These actions prevent creases from forming which may cause a misfeed.

* If you experience feed problems, first clean your magazines and weapon. Fire a couple magazines of new factory ammo to see if this resolves the problem. If not send the magazine back to the manufacturer -- or toss it.
__________________
"Top"
11B5PF7M retired

“Slow Is Smooth, Smooth Is Fast.”
threetango is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 02:35 AM   #5
RevV
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 331
Liked 238 Times on 161 Posts
Likes Given: 201

Default

Threetango, thank you very much for posting that long and helpful post! Those myths are persistent even among knowledgeable shooters.
RevV is offline  
 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 09:12 PM   #6
threetango
Retired Army First Sgt
SFF_MODERATOR.png
 
threetango's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 1,246
Liked 740 Times on 539 Posts
Likes Given: 653

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RevV View Post
Threetango, thank you very much for posting that long and helpful post! Those myths are persistent even among knowledgeable shooters.
My pleasure Rev. If you or anyone can glean something from the articles that will help then it's all worth the time to look into it. Also, it's nice to have someone on the forum that takes the interest you do.
__________________
"Top"
11B5PF7M retired

“Slow Is Smooth, Smooth Is Fast.”
threetango is offline  
RevV Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 03:26 PM   #7
SHOOTER13
RETIRED MODERATOR
SFF_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
 
SHOOTER13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: PENNSYLVANIA
Posts: 3,388
Liked 761 Times on 618 Posts
Likes Given: 1644

Default

Truth be told...I've fired two fully loaded magazines from a 1911a1 that had been that way for decades...the ammo was marked Frankford Arsenal and was dated '43.

The original box still had 36 cartridges left in it. It was my grandfathers...and his brother...my uncle...let me shot the 14 before he took the Remington Rand for his collection.
__________________


__________________
SHOOTER13 is offline  
2
People Like This 
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2017, 01:46 AM   #8
RevV
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 331
Liked 238 Times on 161 Posts
Likes Given: 201

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SHOOTER13 View Post
Truth be told...I've fired two fully loaded magazines from a 1911a1 that had been that way for decades...the ammo was marked Frankford Arsenal and was dated '43.

The original box still had 36 cartridges left in it. It was my grandfathers...and his brother...my uncle...let me shot the 14 before he took the Remington Rand for his collection.
It's nice to hear an article backed up by personal experience! Thanks for sharing.

My first 1911 was a Remington Rand that came from a WWII vet.

I decided to trade it because the firing pin was warn and needed to be replaced, but replacing the firing pin would have destroyed the collector value.
RevV is offline  
SHOOTER13 Likes This 
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ammo Storage Tips threetango Ammo & Reloading 0 06-16-2016 08:43 PM
love my socom 16 but have a magazine issue snoplow Springfield Armory M1A Rifle 2 03-29-2016 03:44 PM
Magazine ad5md Springfield Armory M1911 1 01-19-2016 09:38 PM
Magazine Question everyday Springfield Armory XD 3 12-31-2015 01:53 PM
Guns Magazine - FREE! pokute General Firearms Forum 0 07-23-2015 06:53 PM

Springfield and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to SpringField Armory USA. SpringFieldForum.com is not in any way associated with SpringField Armory USA.